tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post4354331530738061340..comments2023-11-03T11:37:13.579-04:00Comments on Something Old, Nothing New: The Charlie Dog ProblemJaime J. Weinmanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15128500411119962998noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-11322470897581891922009-12-29T21:31:12.037-05:002009-12-29T21:31:12.037-05:00Not really - it always seemed to be about "TH...<i>Not really - it always seemed to be about "THIS is a chicken!" It was pretty formulaic in its own way.</i><br /><br />That's only the first few cartoons, though, when they thought it was going to be a Henery Hawk series. Once he was demoted, the stories could range from Foghorn vs. Dog to Foghorn babysits terrifying genius kid to Foghorn's romance troubles, with the occasional return appearance by Henery. None of the plots were particularly original, but they alternated a lot.Jaime J. Weinmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15128500411119962998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-6937255305480980742009-12-29T21:21:46.293-05:002009-12-29T21:21:46.293-05:00(Foghorn Leghorn, I think, is the closest the stud...<i>(Foghorn Leghorn, I think, is the closest the studio came to a durable, successful series that doesn't have much to do with the chase format; once Henery Hawk was mostly dropped, the characters' motivations could be very different from one film to another.)</i><br /><br />Not really - it always seemed to be about "THIS is a chicken!" It was pretty formulaic in its own way.Thadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04443425643665474645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-17299060284240127092009-12-16T22:18:44.332-05:002009-12-16T22:18:44.332-05:00Cultural and economic changes might've indirec...Cultural and economic changes might've indirectly influenced the creatives changes at WB. People were settling down after WWII, then there was the block book ban of 1950, so both of those together might've left less room for experimentation. <br /><br />The only one of Jones' latter creative changes that had a real negative consequence was making Daffy a foil for Bugs. Bugs already had five villains during the decade, including Wile E. Coyote, Marvin the Martian, and Tazmanian Devil, but Daffy would soon become THE perennial loser in the Looney Tunes lineup.Yeldarb86https://www.blogger.com/profile/10131603833394294520noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-21985421624823621582009-12-16T19:11:32.575-05:002009-12-16T19:11:32.575-05:00I really wish they had continued the Charlie Dog c...I really wish they had continued the Charlie Dog cartoons because I think the character had real potential. <br /><br />One thing that stopped Charlie from developing is that he was too much like Bugs in that he was a streetwise guy who had an easy time getting the better of his foils.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-11669180347636038072009-12-16T17:19:20.989-05:002009-12-16T17:19:20.989-05:00Anon- I would say both.Anon- I would say both.Ricardo Cantoralhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00518171797365794688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-85211449699283954662009-12-16T16:58:22.732-05:002009-12-16T16:58:22.732-05:00It's "All in the Family" that the Th...It's "All in the Family" that the Three Bears series is precursor to, rather than "Simpsons", particularly evident in "A Bear for Punishment", a brilliant cartoon very much ahead of its time. When was the last time animation was ahead of live action? This could have been it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-31399828339794553672009-12-16T16:35:05.610-05:002009-12-16T16:35:05.610-05:00As for Three Bears, that doesn't surprise me t...As for Three Bears, that doesn't surprise me theaters stopped asking for them because it was a dark cartoon series. Papa Bear is not a grumpy moron with heart of gold, he is extremely violent and hates his family. It was decades ahead of it's time, long before The Simpsons and it's long list of imitators.Ricardo Cantoralhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00518171797365794688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-16939044196554656462009-12-16T16:24:17.535-05:002009-12-16T16:24:17.535-05:00The 50's pretty much marked the absolute insis...The 50's pretty much marked the absolute insistence of formula at Warners and the directors mostly imposing this were Chuck Jones and Friz Freleng. Bugs always wins, Daffy is an ass, Sylester chases Tweety, etc. This is when both directors started to slide. They were content with the chase toons though a few their deviations were pretty good. <br /><br />The only one who didn't stick to the rigid formula was Robert Mckimson, the person who sadly seems to receive all the hate during for his directorial career. Foghorn Leghorn and his strange relationship with the dog was already mentioned. Daffy was nutty in Mckimson's films until the late 1950's and once again teamed him up with and Porky, except that they were clearly only established with the authority figure and heckler relationship.Ricardo Cantoralhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00518171797365794688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-66806384955518964912009-12-16T16:07:00.280-05:002009-12-16T16:07:00.280-05:00I think one reason for the lack of topical humor i...I think one reason for the lack of topical humor in the early 50's was that producer Eddie Selzer demanded none of it when he took charge of WB animation. A paragraph in "Chuck Amuck" mentions this, and Jones points out characteristically that Bugs was never really a threat to Ike. <br /><br />Consider also what was happening to Jones' colleagues at UPA at the time. (A subject far too deep to cover here.) Red baiting was in full swing, and contemporary, "hip" cartoons could get you in trouble. Better stick to the chase format and keep McCarthy busy elsewhere.Stevehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12098471743485897147noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-84805848727929501162009-12-16T16:00:02.658-05:002009-12-16T16:00:02.658-05:00Personally, I think the Bears cartoons are hilario...Personally, I think the Bears cartoons are hilarious in a "Married With Children" sitcom kind of way. They're a bit over the top, but they never fail to crack me up. I believe Stan Freberg was the voice of Junior, and he did a great job. The Bugs Bunny cartoon where he fights them off is quite good as well ("Tell me more about my eyes!!!!").<br /><br />To me, this marks the end of Daffy's golden era. I really don't like Daffy being established as the bad guy, so I always prefer the older cartoons where at the very least you see him acting out as a result of self-preservation. Granted, he does that somewhat when he's up against Bugs, but in the earlier cartoons Daffy appears (to me at least) to be a more sympathetic character even if he is a bit overbearing.mackdaddygnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-80934520249324968892009-12-16T14:42:36.784-05:002009-12-16T14:42:36.784-05:00Part of the reason for the lack of topical referen...Part of the reason for the lack of topical references to pop culture in the early 1950s was that J.L. and the other moguls were still trying to pretend that television didn't exist -- or that if nobody talked about what was on TV, it would just go away.<br /><br />As far as Charlie, Jones was already seeing by his last two cartoons that a little bit of him could go a long way. He and Maltese tried altering the endings of the shorts in their Charlie-Porky trilogy (Charlie gets booted in the first, a psychotic Porky forces him to stay in the second and a psychotic Porky gets hauled off by the dog catcher in the third), but the body of the three cartoons were as formalistic as the Pepe series.<br /><br />They tried changing that up with "Dog Gone South" and "A Hound for Trouble", but you still had the basic problem of how far you could go with making Charlie both obnoxious within his established personality and at the same time likable to the audience (Charlie being almost like a reverse Casper in traveling around making enemies instead of friends). <br /><br />Rather than get caught up in a situation that would have required some really inventive writing by Maltese to keep it fresh, Jones seems to have decided to retire the character (though he does get a cameo in McKimson's "Dog Tales" and reappears in a linking segment for "The Bugs Bunny Show", where they could go with his strongest bit without having to come up with a new plotline for the character).J Leenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-41967538477323408642009-12-16T14:03:03.809-05:002009-12-16T14:03:03.809-05:00It might have been interesting had Hubie and Berti...It might have been interesting had Hubie and Bertie continued, playing their mind games on an escalating series of stronger adversaries. This would have made H&B into a pair of Gaslighting comic heroes rather than a merely irritating duo.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6956070.post-80585308303020461432009-12-16T09:54:49.692-05:002009-12-16T09:54:49.692-05:00Very interesting, and you're right about the t...Very interesting, and you're right about the topical references- in the '50s references to TV shows are what happened a lot (Wideo Wabbit, Person to Bunny, etc.)<br /><br />Also, I really wish that the Hubie and Bertie series would've went on for a least a few more years, it was always one of my favorites. I think that it would have been easy to sustain it as a series, as all they need is a predator to play their mind games on (Also, it wouldn't always have to be Claude Cat, they could've mixed it up by using other characters). And unlike something like Pepe Le Pew, there's more room for new locations and situations.BrianCnoreply@blogger.com